444 Paul Casey

Jeffrey Feldberg: [00:00:00] What happens when you blend purpose-driven leadership with a relentless commitment to personal growth?

You get Paul Casey.

A coach, speaker, and entrepreneur who's helped thousands of leaders stop reacting and start growing forward. Paul's journey began in the world of education where he rose through the ranks, not by chasing titles, but by chasing impact.

But the real story starts when he walked away from security to launch a business built entirely around helping others maximize their potential. Through his company Growing Forward Services, Paul has become a trusted guide to executives, business owners, and teams who are navigating the pressures of leadership burnout and purpose. He's not just a leadership coach. He's a life reframer with a voice shaped by decades of lived experience Paul is known for turning overwhelm into clarity and toxic culture into cohesive growth. As the author of multiple books and hosts of the Grow Forward Today podcast, Paul doesn't preach from a pedestal.

He shares from the trenches. [00:01:00] This is the conversation that reminds you leadership isn't about having all the answers. It's about having the courage to keep asking better questions and to keep growing no matter what.

And before we start this episode, a quick word from our sponsor, Deep Wealth and the 90 Day Deep Wealth Mastery Program. Here's Jane, a graduate who says, and I quote, the Deep Wealth Mastery Program prevented me from making what would have been one of the biggest mistakes of my career. I almost signed on the dotted line with an unsolicited offer that I now realized would have shortchanged my hard work and my future had I accepted that offer. Deep Wealth Mastery has tilted the playing field to my advantage.

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So what do you think?

As I hear that, that's exactly what gets me out of bed every day. That's my mission. That's the team's mission here at Deep Wealth to literally change the social fabric of society. One business owner at a time, one liquidity event at a time, and my Deep Wealth Nation, what I want you to know, the Deep Wealth Mastery Program, it isn't theory.

It's from the trenches. It's the only one based on a nine figure deal. And that deal, that was my deal. You know my story. I said no to a seven figure offer. I created the system that later on, myself and my business partners, we said yes to a different buyer, [00:03:00] a different offer, a nine figure deal. That's what we now call the Deep Wealth Mastery Program or the Scale For Ultimate Sales system.

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Deep Wealth Nation welcome to another episode of the Deep Wealth Podcast. Well, we have an alumnus of the Deep Wealth Podcast. Back on. We have Paul, who's with us, who has just been an incredible guest before. Paul, welcome back to the Deep Wealth Podcast. Last time you're on, it was episode 1 54, which seems like.

Eons ago. There's been so many more members of the Deep Wealth community that have now joined us, what we affectionately call Deep Wealth Nation. And I know there's been so much going on with you behind the scenes offline, you and I were talking. So that [00:05:00] said, Paul, why don't you bring everyone up to speed in terms of what you've been doing with your incredible leadership system, of what you have and what you've been doing with that, where it's going and how you're growing forward, pun intended, and helping entrepreneurs and others do the same with you.

So what's the story behind the story, Paul? Where have you been? What have you been up to?

Paul Casey: Hey Jeffrey. It is so good to be back on the show. this entrepreneur ride is quite the journey. This is my 10th year in business now, so woo-hoo. Gotta celebrate that this year. And it's been growing a little bit. Every year. I'm a solopreneur and as you put in the nice little plug there, growing forward services is my business.

And so I do leadership coaching, executive coaching. I do, team coaching. And soft skills training, both leadership and personal growth. And so somewhere along the line, it was just in the last two years, I also got approached locally by a nonprofit that I was an alumnus of called Leadership Tri-Cities, and they said, Hey, would you be our executive [00:06:00] director?

And I went wait, what? I have my own business. And they're like, yeah, well just give us whatever time that you have and we just need you to help bring it back to life. And I'm like, well, I love the organization and maybe I could give it 16 hours a week to do that in addition to my full-time job.

And it was quite the challenge. And I started a little bit of burnout as a result of putting a nonprofit on top of a full-time, solopreneur business. Just resigned from that in December. And then I had the hit of the government cutting out their coaching and training programs due to them slimming down.

And that was a big hit for the little guy, me, because that cut out over, I think it was like $35,000 of income from the previous year to this year. And I was like, uhoh, I might be in trouble. It's one of my biggest clients. So then I got a couple new clients and they're both in the healthcare field, so I'm wondering like, what is opening up there for me?

And that's just very [00:07:00] current. So that brings you up to speed, Jeffrey.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Wow. It looks like the universe is winking at you. So first there's healthcare and you said, oh yeah, sure. I'll just tack that on and then surprise, we can talk about that because you know what, as. Leaders of an organization, whether we're a hired gun, whether we're the founder, the entrepreneur, how easy is it, whether it's not necessarily a nonprofit approaching us, maybe a department approaching us, or we have this idea, oh yeah, let's take on this new initiative.

Doesn't sound so bad, let's go for it. And we find ourselves in some interesting situations. Then now as you've been going through this, it looks like you've been getting more into healthcare. I'm just curious, just before we do some deep dives on leadership and blending and making sure everything is going forward in the right direction, what have you noticed?

I'm just curious, from one industry to now, the healthcare industry. Is it same blank, different day, or there's some different things going on that you can appreciate from where you were to where you're right now?

Paul Casey: There's a lot of similarity. I think wherever there's people, there are issues. [00:08:00] So, I've found that there is conflict on just about every team that I've been with, and there is an opportunity to help diagnose what is going on that team that is lowering morale. All leaders need this outside source to come in, which I provide and diagnose what's going on with their team.

I love doing team health interviews. I call 'em where I interview, just back to back all day long. Sometimes for two days, try to find out where is the source of tension, what are the needs that are not getting met by this team? And then try to figure out. What do they need then that will raise morale on this team?

Where are the sources of conflict? And so, yeah, I have found that to be in, whether I'm working with the national laboratory, the government with a digital marketing company or with healthcare, it's the same issues.

Jeffrey Feldberg: That was so interesting and in reviewing our last conversation, in preparing for today, and actually I got these stats right from your site and Deepp Nation. I want you to think about [00:09:00] this for a second. When you receive some kind of training, there's an immediate 22% improvement, but then you can four x that, it goes up to 88%.

When you have coaching that's gonna be involved just to help you get through that and implement that. And once you're coached, you have a 77% increase in your leadership skills and a 50% benefit to your effectiveness in your personal life. And so Paul, give me that all day long. That sounds absolutely fantastic.

And it also sounds like now the master, the teacher, in some ways, you become the student in regards to, okay, it's a new industry. You're taking on some new clients. But let's go back to that very earnest question that was asked of you, and maybe we can look at that for just a moment. Because again, it's maybe not a nonprofit for listeners of the Deep Health Nation, but it could be a new initiative, a new product, a new service.

Maybe we're gonna go into a new country, whatever the case may be. Can you walk us through, with hindsight being 2020, were there some. [00:10:00] What we call inflection points or blind spots. When you were initially asked about that, that you said yes, and then what happened afterwards and how you might've treated that somewhat differently, knowing what you now know.

Paul Casey: Yeah, I think in hindsight, I would recommend to all listeners today to count the costs and really count the actual costs. And I know it's a little crystal balling to know how this is gonna impact your own health, your own wealth, your own, family your own business, it's really difficult to see the whole cost, but do the due diligence of figuring out what is the impact on all of those areas.

Because what I realized was my marriage started to suffer a little bit. My wife's like, you're never around. I was for you when you said yes to the taking over the nonprofit, but I didn't realize it was going to erode a lot of the time that we had even on weekends. I didn't realize my health was gonna be impacted by it.

I went to the doctor a year and a half ago, and all [00:11:00] my markers were trending high, like cholesterol, triglycerides, blood glucose level, all those, and none of 'em were off the chart. Terrible, but enough to make my doctor concerned. And I'm like oh, this isn't good. And then to see like, well, now I'm rushing to clients.

My current clients because I also feel guilty that I'm not giving enough attention to the nonprofit. And then when I was working on the nonprofit, I was feeling guilty that I wasn't working on my business. So these were all things that I didn't realize on the front end. So count the cost as probably the best advice that I could give.

Jeffrey Feldberg: I know that's easier said than done. Sure. Count the cost. Oh yeah, yeah. Okay. When it actually happens though, when we find ourselves in that situation. How do we count the cost? Because I'm sure when you were approached to, Hey, can you help us from a nonprofit side, we really need some help. And you're great on leadership side.

Well, you haven't experienced that before. So what can we do? Is there a framework? Are there some questions or strategies that we can deploy?

Paul Casey: I think again, in hindsight [00:12:00] what I've done that board chair was so eager to get me plugged in so he could. Back off that I needed more time with the board, you know, to find out what they actually wanted, what they needed. Not what was the minimal effort required, but you know what I mean?

Like the, that I wanted to find out what they actually needed and what I could have pulled back from and found out what was good enough. 'cause I'm not a good enough guy. I'm a maximizer on the strength finder, right? Everything I touch, I wanna make better. And so it's really hard for me to pull back from that excellence pursuit and it would've been nice to know where the bar was set.

So I guess that would be my first tip, is to meet with that new client, that nonprofit, that wherever you're going, and find out where that level, where the bar is set. Then I probably, my second tip would've been if I was coaching myself. Script out a schedule of what that looks like. So how does this impact?

My day-to-day [00:13:00] schedule because I'm a time blocker Jeffrey. I love time management. I think we might've talked about that in the last episode. Time management. I've written a little book on it. I've studied it for over 25 years. I love time management. I'm sort of a OCD nerd when it comes to that. And I could have really scripted that out way better.

And blocked my time better instead of just going like, here we go. I can do 16 hours a week on top of a full-time job and realize that is really undoable. I.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Sure, and at the risk of being personal, which I'll put this out there. Was there any ego involved in the sense that they unintentionally, or maybe intentionally they threw this your way, maybe boosted you up in the back of your mind thinking, oh yeah, yeah, they're right. I'm such a terrific person and I'm a go-getter and I can handle this.

I'm just gonna do it.

Paul Casey: so, no one has asked me that question, Jeffrey, but as soon as you said it, I smiled. Because when he looked at me in that coffee shop and he said, you're the [00:14:00] guy, Paul, it does boost your ego when someone says, you're the guy, or I need your help, or you're the one right. There isn't something inside of you that swells up and says well now I have to do it.

Like I'm the guy, right? I'm the one that could actually rescue, quote unquote this organization, and it wasn't about me. But there was that honor of being asked and saying, all right, let's go. I'm gonna make this happen.

Jeffrey Feldberg: I would suppose though social programming in the back of your mind. I know that if this were me, okay, this is a charity. They're a nonprofit. This is really doing a good thing. I have the skillset that I can help. Man, if I said no, what kind of a jerk am I being that I'm saying no to this nonprofit that could really benefit from that, that these pressures are mounting up on us?

And what's interesting here as leaders, again, it may not be a nonprofit, maybe it's one of our senior leadership team members, maybe they have. Their own incentive, nothing to do with us. Maybe it's a bigger bonus check for them that it's gonna benefit them. Hey [00:15:00] Jeffrey, can you help us out on this? I think this would be a terrific project for the company, and they're selling hard on this.

We're taking it at face value. But to go with what Ronald Reagan said, Hey, trust, but verify. And Paul, again, hindsight's always 2020 as leaders though, and in your case, and you're being so open with us, so vulnerable with us. I really appreciate that. Thoughts on, Hey, so and so. I hear you on this. Let me sleep on this.

Let me take a day or two really think about this. I'll probably come back with some questions. I just need to understand more of what this could look like and how that fits or doesn't fit into my schedule, and I'll get back to you. But feeling that pressure of I need to say yes, and having the ego and that social programming all kick in.

I mean, how do we deal with that as leaders? You're the master at this poll and. Looking back, Hey, even you felt that pressure and went in a direction That sounds like it's working out now at the time, though, it may not have, so I'm wondering what your thoughts are on that.

Paul Casey: I think we have to realize what is the motive of saying yes. A lot of us [00:16:00] have trouble saying no, but I think. The further we go along in our careers, the more nos we have to do to protect our few yeses. I think, I can't remember who said it, but it's like you protect one yes with a thousand nos.

Isn't that good? It's a thousand nos, but we, maybe it's 'cause we wanna grow. Like This is a cool challenge or maybe we're a pleaser and we wanna please other people by saying that. Yes. Maybe one, we wanna avoid conflict. Maybe one wanna keep that client or like, Ooh, that client could lead to another cool client.

So I gotta say yes to this one. And we play these mental games in our head and then we just utter the yes without pushing back from the table and go, can I think about that? And then when we think about it, when I talk about work-life balance, and again, preaching to myself on this I think we have to look through a boundary lens.

Most of us need more boundaries because we just love working and we love our jobs. We love our companies, we love our clients. And so if we can push back from the decision and [00:17:00] pause, then we stop, look and listen. So the stop is we ask ourselves things like. Do I even want to do this? Or am I trying to please somebody else?

What am I gonna receive for my participation in this? I could be a little bit selfish about that. If I agree to this and I'm successful at it, will it continue to be rewarding or will it become oppressive? And that would've been a good question to ask myself at that moment. And we look at our other commitments and we count the cost, like I mentioned for this one.

And we think about when we say yes. What's gonna have to go from my schedule? See, that's Jeffrey. What I didn't do is like some is gonna have to go. Now I did a little bit, like I said, I'm not gonna go to networking things or I'm not gonna do as much social media if I say yes to this, but I did not remove enough things from my calendar to put the new commitment in.

Then finally I would say the listen part is listen to your feelings. And I know your intuition, your gut is just one of many filters when we leaders make decisions. But [00:18:00] if you find yourself hedging or hesitating or you feel cornered or trapped or maybe some tightness in your body or maybe even a nervous twitch I think that's our body going like, whoa, slow down.

Slow down the train. We gotta think about this a little bit more. I.

Jeffrey Feldberg: It's so interesting because what you're talking about, get to know yourself, what some people call those gut feelings. Yeah, I got this gut feeling. Listen to that. Don't ignore that. Just because it doesn't show up in a balance sheet or in a profit and loss doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. And then I know one of the things that you're an expert in, Paul, it's the leadership animals and knowing the kind of animal archetype that you are.

Can you walk us through that at Deep Wealth nation, so what is leadership animals and where do you fall into that and how can we leverage that to our advantage? I.

Paul Casey: So it came from a book years ago by Gary Smalley, John Trent. It was in the middle of a marriage book of all places, but they're these four animal personality types, the lion, the otter, the golden retriever, and the beaver. Now they correspond pretty quickly to [00:19:00] the disc, which many people have taken the colors.

Social styles. Many of us as leaders have taken these assessments and I love pretty much all of 'em, right? I don't, I, I haven't met an assessment I don't like they're all in the arsenal that I can pull out. But I love the animal one 'cause it's fun and you don't feel labeled by them. When somebody goes, Jeffrey, stop being such a lion, and then you go, ha. Yeah. And we can actually tease each other, but it's not about the teasing, it's about self-awareness and it's about custom communicating with the other people around us. So here's a quick overview of that. And by the way, Jeffrey, I want to give it to everybody, it's free on my website, growingforwardservices[dot]net

Just go right at the top, it's a free link to the personality, and then you can get a quick result. But here we go. So we got the lion personality. The lion is the hard driver, right? The bold, direct, courageous. It's about metrics and taking new ground and bringing the ball down the field. And, all those metaphors.

They make great decisions. They're very decisive and they sleep [00:20:00] well at night and they get things done. They love results. Now all of our strengths have overdone become a weakness, which could pop up under stress. So alliance's weakness is being intimidated, overpowering, intense and they could struggle with being a workaholic.

They're the ones that pop their laptop open on the beach in Maui, and their family's going really? Can't you just put that away for a few seconds and relax with us? But lions can be so intense all the time that it's hard to relax. Then we have the Otter personality. The otter is playful joking around, creative, spontaneous.

They're usually talking and laughing. Super positive optimists just fun to have around, especially in brainstorming meetings. Now, the negatives of the Otter are they can be a little flighty. They could sort of bounce over the top of projects, but not finish anything. They're usually messy. They're usually late or tardy to meetings, right?

Because [00:21:00] they always think they can get one more thing done. And usually they're talking a little bit too much. They need to do a little bit more in the listening category. Then we go over to the Golden Retriever and beaver. Those are more the introverted styles. The goldens are very patient, they're team players.

They don't cause any trouble. They're very conscientious. And get the job done. They're warm and empathetic. The weaknesses though of the Golden is they can get their feelings hurt pretty easily. They take things personally. they hate change 'cause they love the routines. They hate conflict 'cause they're pleasers at their core and they stuff their feelings down and become little passive aggressive.

And then finally, the beaver style. Busy as a beaver is where that comes from. They're very industrious. They're usually working on two things at once. They love research and numbers and analyses and boy, they just loved going down deep into the details, very productive, their weaknesses. They can forget about people.

Like during Covid, they were like, wow, this [00:22:00] is great. I don't have to talk to anybody in person. They can get way down deep in those numbers. They can be overly critical of themselves, which makes them overly critical of others, and they can become perfectionists. So that's a quick overview on those four styles I.

Jeffrey Feldberg: And so for someone in Deep Health Nation who's hearing us talk and they're hearing us talk about, well listen to your gut feelings, or maybe you're a lion, an otter, a golden retriever, a beaver. They're saying, what kind of nonsense is this? You had me at Yeah. Making my leadership more effective and I. And I'm gonna be doing all these incredible things that are gonna help me grow forward.

And Forex my return on investment. You got me there, but then you lost me on this softer side of things. So Paul, you've been there, you've done that. For someone who's thinking those types of thoughts, what could you share with them on what some people would say is more the art side of business or the softer side of business?

Paul Casey: Yeah, there are some of my clients that are like, well, it has to be a little bit more of that. The DISC is a little bit more scientific, it's been around for so many years, and we want to go with these [00:23:00] assessments that are very scientific. It's really the same thing, right?

So when I introduce the personality animal personality styles it's just a lot more fun. And I watch the people relax. We get to tease each other about things. I laugh at myself because I know what my weaknesses are usually, and everybody else does too. But here's the key, like if we can't get along together, we can't work together very well.

Productivity comes when we were happier at work. When we enjoy each other one of the companies I'm gonna work with, I've already been warned. They're like, yeah, they don't get along very well together. And I'm already like, all right, challenge accepted. Let's figure out what's going on here.

But one of the comments in my intake form for them that they're saying is they don't respect each other's personalities. They wanna just keep driving and they don't want to have to deal with, quote unquote, deal with these other personalities instead of trying to respect them and honor them. So I think the bottom line does get impacted Jeffrey when we do care about [00:24:00] these softer skills and life just becomes a better culture to work in.

Jeffrey Feldberg: And so as we're talking about this, and again, Paul. You've been so open and vulnerable and you're out there, you're really leading the charge in terms of, well, how do I grow forward? How do I take my leadership to the next level? To your point right now, it's all kinds of disruption and uncertainty in the marketplace, and that's coming from the political front, but it just as easily could be something else.

You can fill in the blank. It could be a recession, it could be some kind of geopolitical event. It could be who knows what. There's uncertainty, there's change. And for many businesses right now, like yourself. Oh my goodness. The way that I've been doing business up to this point, that's not gonna work anymore.

I have to make some changes. So with what you've been through just now, everything that you've shared with us, the danger I would think is as I'm looking to embrace change, maybe I'm gonna take on too much where it's gonna spill over onto the personal side and that's gonna spill back over negatively onto the business side.

How do we grow forward smart in a way that [00:25:00] not so much balancing as opposed to harmonizing. Business personal and having those important relationships on all fronts and doing well for the business. How do we approach that in times of uncertainty?

Paul Casey: Yeah, I heard a speaker at a conference many years ago. I think his name was Wayne Cordero and he said, I want you to think about work life balance. 'cause that's really impossible, because one minute would be out of balance if you tried to balance everything. I want you to think of a teeter-totter.

That playground implement that's probably been outlawed nowadays. All of our childhood playground things have been rendered unsafe now. But that's pretty funny. But the teeter totter. I want you to think about work on one side, life on the other, but the fulcrum is what I want you to focus on.

And he said that little triangle that's at the in the middle between work and life, sometimes in our businesses, it requires us to be all hands on deck. We have to work some all-nighters. We have to get things done to meet a deadline for a client. We're gonna shift that fulcrum way over to the work side for a season.

Sometimes we [00:26:00] have a family injury or a parent that's aging or there's something else going on. There's some relational conflict with our children, and we have to move that fulcrum way over to the other side, to the life side of things for a season to deal with that. And we're always trying to sort of bring it back to the middle.

Just like a tennis player, as they hit a shot, they come back to the middle, they hit another shot and they come back to the middle. We have to do that as well, but it's, fluid. It's not rigid because if we spend too much time in either area, the other one starts to atrophy, and that's when the relationship breaks down at home or our work life suffers.

And people are like, you're not here enough. Like, where are you? And so we have to make sure that we don't stay in overdrive in either area or our engine will burn out.

Jeffrey Feldberg: And so speaking of burnout, so often it creeps up on us and then we're not burned out until we are, and wham, it just hits us. So what would be heading into something, some red flags or telltale [00:27:00] signs? Either I'm on the burnout path or better yet, if I'm going down this path, this is likely what's gonna happen.

And I know we don't have a crystal ball. It's impossible to know all those things. That said, though, we can be strategic about it. So thoughts on that?

Paul Casey: I love that question because I call it reading your gauges, right? So each one of us has a different gauge that's going a little hot when we are on the verge of burnout, and if we can catch it then. Before we go into full on burnout, which by the way is a very scary place. I've had clients that come into my office completely gray in the face.

They're ashen they plop down on the couch and I've had one say, I'm on administrative leave right now because I don't have enough energy to get to work. And I saw the look on that gal's face that day and I went wow. That's what burnout looks like. They forget their favorite color, they forget what they have an enjoyment in so long and people would describe them as zombies or going through the motions.

So we wanna come back from that. That's what I love about your question. It's like, how do [00:28:00] we catch that sooner? So here's a couple telltale signs. 50% of people would say irritability is the number one sign that you're heading towards burnout. You start snipping and sniping at people around you. They would describe you as short, with other people.

And people will say like, what's wrong with you today? And you're like, what? Yeah, that, right? That, that what answer? Is not like you. So irritability is one for me. Creativity, a lack of creativity is one. I have lots of ideas. Love to share 'em all the time. And if I go dark in my brain when someone asks for a problem to be solved, I know I'm close to burnout.

Another one is dropped balls. And if you've probably heard the illustration, like we have balls that we're juggling all day. Some are rubber and some are glass, right? The rubber balls bounce back 'cause they're more. Agile, but the glass balls, like possibly our core relationships will break, right?

If we drop those. But I'll be like, you know, sitting at home and I'll get a text and be like, Paul, are you coming to coffee shop for our coaching? [00:29:00] And I'll be like, oh no. Like I was moving so fast, I didn't even put it on my calendar. Then I know I'm in trouble that I have too much on my plate, that the balls are starting to fall onto the floor.

Another one could be you're typically a peaceful person, but you're battling with anxiety more than ever before. You can't sleep. You wake up at 2:00 AM and your brain doesn't shut off. You're worried about the worst case all the time. That could be a sign of burnout as well. So these are a few of the key signs to be aware of that you gotta pull back from.

Jeffrey Feldberg: So lemme ask you this. As you're talking about that, a few things are coming up and so for starters, perhaps one strategy would be, especially with our loved ones, they're almost like the canary in the coal mines. Hey, loved ones. I'm taking on this new project and I'm hoping for the best. It's good intentions.

I just don't know where it's gonna go. If you see me irritable or if I snap at you, will you please let me know? Because to me, that tells me something's not going right and I may be missing it, and I, I don't want you to suffer because of that. So that's popping to mind. [00:30:00] But even before it gets there, Paul, I know for myself saying, no, my goodness, the guilt comes on and I feel terrible, and I'm waffling back and forth.

And I'll either not say no, but I'll put it off. So it's forcing me to say no later or begrudgingly. Sometimes I'll just. Take it because taking it for me is easier than saying no, even though I know I should be saying no. So how do we gracefully and with our own mental health in mind and what's best for the business, how do we say no?

That leaves both parties intact and as well as can be feeling good about it.

Paul Casey: When you were talking, I reminded of the Steve Jobs quote. It was something like, it's only by saying no, that you can concentrate on the things that are really important. And coming from Steve Jobs, I wouldn't even thought he would've said something like that 'cause he was pretty much of a driver, but. How do you say no? So, I think it was in an entrepreneur magazine. I like to say, Jeffrey, I'm not smart, but I'm resourceful, right? So I get a lot of my quotes from other people. But there was an article, I can't remember who wrote it, but he said there's four approaches. To [00:31:00] saying no. So first of all, there is the flat out.

No, but you do that in such a kind way like saying, I really appreciate you, Jeffrey, for thinking of me like that means a lot already. And that really made me give this some deep thought because it's you. However, I cannot, keep this commitment or I can't say yes to this thing. I really love how that's so smooth and it really puts the emphasis on the other person.

So that's one of 'em. You can also tinker with the timing. So maybe it's this season like, you really love this idea, or you love pursuing that industry that you're gonna start jumping into. Or that opportunity. But right now, no. You're going into vacation season with your family or you have something else pressing.

So you say like, I'm gonna say a delayed Yes. Sort of like the delayed send you do for email. Another thing you could do is you could accept and say yes partially, but with conditions. So you're gonna alter their request and say, I can do this piece of what you're saying, but nothing [00:32:00] else. I can set the vision for that, but I can't be on the ground.

Orchestrating it or vice versa. I can orchestrate this one piece, but I am not gonna stay up late at night thinking about the vision. And then finally, I guess the other opportunity would be to say offer an alternative solution. Help that person figure out their next step, even though you have to say no you're almost gonna turn into their coach and say I can't do it, but let's spend some time coming up with some other options to help you get to your goal.

Accomplished. Really what you're saying there, Jeffrey, is we need people in our life like our family, that we warn in advance that we're going into a season, we're going into the tunnel, but there's still light at the end of that tunnel. Or we need accountability buddies that are gonna help us. Say no.

They call it your nobody. Isn't that funny? Like your no buddy is the person that's gonna help you say no because they know. You always say yes, but they're gonna stop you and go like, all right, let's think about that for a minute. So we all need a no buddy.

Jeffrey Feldberg: I love [00:33:00] that. So we have an accountability partner. A play on the word nobody. It's a nobody that's helping us. Jeffrey, I know you wanna say yes on that. Let me remind you though, you've got this, you got this. What do you want to give up if you're gonna be doing that? So I love that. And as a follow up to that, and so I hear you on the strategies of what's there.

It's really being authentic and putting it yourself out there of, Hey, thanks so much for thinking of me, really honored. I gave it even that much more thought because you did think of me and I was really touched by that. Having said that, and then you list why it's gonna be a hard no on that. What do you do though, Paul?

In a situation where we have committed nothing's perfect though. And it's now okay. Maybe this wasn't the best decision and I'm not only not enjoying it, but other areas of my life are suffering from this. And I'm gonna take the assumption here that it's still early enough in the process. So lemme make up a crazy example.

It's not as though I accepted a keynote speech and the day before the keynote speech I'm saying I can't do it. I've just been too busy. I haven't had time to work on it. It's something like what [00:34:00] you did, perhaps, okay, you're now gonna be helping this nonprofit. It's gonna be some kind of board advisory role.

It's a long-term commitment here and early on you're saying, oh my goodness, I think I took more on than I was really prepared to do. So how do you deal with that kind of situation? Do you honor that? Do you back out of that? How do you deal with that?

Paul Casey: I think first of all, we have to take full responsibility for the choice that we make, so. I was all in when I said yes. Right. We can't play the blame game. like to say to blame, put a hyphen between the B and the L and the word blame to blame is to be lame, right? Nobody wants to be lame, right? we don't wanna play the blame game and said, I felt pressured to do that.

Or I, and just try to target all the other people around us for that decision. There's a shortage of people that own their own decisions. So I think the sign of a good leader is owning your choices. So I think we're all in at the front end of that. You asked so what along the way you realize like, is starting to fracture here I think I might be in [00:35:00] trouble.

So what I did, I can only speak from my experience here, is when I realized, the family was impacted, my health was impacted, my business was impacted, I started coming up with an exit strategy and you're like the king of exits Jeffrey. So I know that word sort of rings true with you.

There was an exit strategy to that commitment, and I thought to myself, well, first of all, I'm gonna approach the board and ask for fewer hours. Like I didn't realize how big of a commitment this was, and I'm gonna ramp this down. Could I have only eight hours a month or eight hours a week? And then when I realized that still wasn't enough, I rolled it down to four hours a week, which is almost nothing.

And then I realized I have to resign. From that after 22 months in that role, but I gave them a whole lot of time. I think it's honoring to do a slow ramp down and to set your successor up. So we waited till someone was hired in that role, I set them up with [00:36:00] success with a duty handbook.

Really tried to make it a smooth transition. So the board didn't even know at the end of the day that, that there was a switch of executive directors. I mean, they knew 'cause they hired the person, but it was almost seamless. But I gave them enough time to deal with the change. And I think that's probably the biggest point I could say on that one.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Like a true leader, Paul. So what I'm hearing you say. Own it. Okay. I created this. No one forced me into this. I created this. It's not anyone's fault other than maybe not my fault, but it was good intentions. I just didn't read the situation properly. Okay? Got that straight. I'm not gonna be mad at anyone.

I'm gonna deal with this next strategy I'm hearing you say is, okay, how can I gracefully begin the process to either change that commitment that it does fit within what I'm doing, or if it. Can't or doesn't provide enough of a runway that I can gracefully exit out in a way that doesn't leave the other party feeling the weight or having to just be out there all on their own [00:37:00] now.

And I've really dropped the ball and let them down. And in your case, you gave them plenty of notice. You prepared the successor and everything just worked out really well for you. How am I doing with that in terms of our strategy and leadership approach to that?

Paul Casey: Absolutely. Absolutely. I love the quotes that's, don't let your mouth overload your back. In other words, by saying yes so many times you have now created this load. That you can't bear up under anymore. And so by you summarizing that's really what we're talking about there, right? The most successful people do say no a lot, and they make adjustments when they realize this is unsustainable.

I.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Okay, so really it's an honest reckoning of, I started this, I created this, I'm gonna own it, but now I'm gonna live to my responsibility. I'm gonna do the right and honorable thing in a way that honors everyone, not just the other party, but also myself, my family, my loved ones, and then find the way to do that.

So I hear you on that. And then Paul, a number of times, you and I, we've gone back and forth, we're using [00:38:00] different words and maybe we're saying the same thing, maybe not. When it comes to a balanced life versus a blended life, where do you stand on that? Is one different than the other in your books? Can we have a blended life, or what would a balance like look like?

Thoughts about that?

Paul Casey: I think especially as an entrepreneur. Worklife balance is unattainable or for anybody. I think worklife rhythm, work-life integration, work-life wellness are better terms. If you think about those three work-life rhythm, that's the moving of the fulcrum of the teeter-totter back and forth, right? It's I need to give this more time now.

I need to give this more time. But it's very fluid. Work-life integration is probably the same word you're using with the word blended. I really like that. Because boy, as an entrepreneur, it's just a part of you. You can't go hard stop. All right. Now I'm not gonna think about work ever 'cause I'm with my family or I'm on the boat fishing.

No, it, it just we can't do it. It's like [00:39:00] impossible. We're not wired to do that, but we can still make sure it fits in our story. Then work life. Wellness is this new concept I've heard of, and I really like that too because it makes sure that you're doing this business thing in a sustainable way, one that you don't resent, one that actually is contributing to health as you're pursuing wealth.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Okay, so it's interesting, and you and I are really on the same page personally. I threw out the concept of balance and I said, Hey. Go to a movie or read a book. It just doesn't exist in real life. But to your point, blended, I can blend it because nothing's ever perfect. I can blend doing some business activities also with some personal activities or family activities blended in a way that keeps my mental health.

I. Happy and vibrant as well as my family and the business, my team members. And so I'm right with you on that one. So all that said, and before we start going into wrap up mode, Paul, we've laid the foundations and you've been very gracious of, Hey Jeffrey, I did this and didn't quite [00:40:00] work out the way that I planned, and you've shared some lessons learned.

I am wondering though, coming outta this, what's your secret sauce? Some of it, and obviously we can't do all of this on this episode, but Paul, what's your secret sauce when I'm working with you now with me as a business owner, an entrepreneur, a founder, even a hired gun? It's you. It's me, possibly my team.

We're all going through your coaching program and you're helping us along the way. What's your system? What does it look like in terms of how long do things take and what should we expect to see? And I'll preface it by saying yes, Paul in advance. I agree. Every organization, every entrepreneur is different.

They're in a different place. But generally speaking, what would it look like in terms of the method to really the secret sauce that you've developed on bringing out the best in leaders?

Paul Casey: I think it starts with your core values. So when I start with each of these new. Clients in healthcare the first thing I do is I give them a core values assessment, right? I wanna know out of the 52 or whatever that are on the page, what are their top five? And [00:41:00] I want them to defend that to me. I want them to say, why do those five make it to the top?

Tell me a little story. Don't just say. Which someone would probably poke back and say, that's not a core value. Right. Maybe that's almost a given for a lot of people. But what does family do for you? Is it their source of support for you or is it encouragement? Are you providing for them?

Is that the only reason you have a job? I wanna know that kind of stuff because it's a moment of Self-assessment to say, alright, I am operating out of these core values. Whether I like it or not, I'm actually operating out of them and I have to live in alignment with them. If I'm in dissonance with them, which is that musical term that's like a little bit off like you couldn't listen to a song that was just a little bit off the whole time.

But our lives get off. When they're off those core values and we feel that and that feels awful, and that's when we start heading to burn out faster. So I do that both with individuals. Is assess those core values. 'cause I want to coach 'em in line with those values and bring 'em [00:42:00] back to it when they drift.

I also do that with teams coming up with team core values. Now, we all might have them on our wall right now in our businesses, but I'm not talking actually about those. I'm talking about staff or team core values, the commitments you're making to each other. So you might say communication is a core value.

What does that mean? You're gonna give each other heads ups. gonna go to the person you're offended with first before talking to anyone else. That's where the rubber meets the road, and that's gonna lead to integrity. Where your outside and your inside match up. So it starts with values.

And then the next step, I'm gonna go with each of these teams. We're gonna go to strengths because I think we need to make decisions based on our strengths. when we go in our strengths, we feel strong. When we focus on our weaknesses, we feel weak. Now we gotta get those up, of course, high enough to not be fatal flaws that take us out of the game.

We actually wanna spend more time thinking about those strengths and how can we [00:43:00] maximize those and go to the next level. And then the third thing, and I'll stop with this one, is vision. So now where do we want to go together as a group? So this is team coaching where I wanna say what does this group want to get one year from now?

Let's just talk one year from now. Where do you want to go? This leads to strategic planning usually. And then I can help them break that down into goal setting. With a, of course, a point person, a deadline, the resources needed the next step and the rhythm that's gonna get them to that vision. If it's you personally, wanna know what your vision is to be better one year from now in your family, in your recreation, in your professional development in your leadership.

And I want to help you get there. So my program is very fluid, it's very organic. But that is sort of the skeleton of where I try to take a person or a company.

Jeffrey Feldberg: And it is very appropriate actually, because really what I'm hearing you say is, yes, Jeffrey, everyone is on a different path and for me to sit here and give a one [00:44:00] size fits all, one it wouldn't work, and two is just not true. So I'm hearing you say, I'm gonna do a needs analysis, and based on what I'm getting back from the feedback from the insights.

From where a leader or a company is, I can fine tune my program to get them in tip top shape fairly quickly and effortlessly. And I like what you're saying about the vision, actually reminds me of your book Leading With Supervision book, and I like how it's a little bit of a play on words there and what you've done with that, but very much one of your strengths in terms of what you're doing.

And let me ask you this before we go into wrap up mode, Paul. I know, my goodness, there are so many questions I haven't asked is one question that I haven't yet asked that you'd like to share with Deepal Nation or even a topic or a theme or message that we haven't yet covered. I.

Paul Casey: I would say the, on that vision, just to keep riding that one out a little bit more. Like without a vision, you're gonna be the same as you were yesterday. Tomorrow, right? We have to have a personal vision that gives us that quest for, I wanna be better, I want us to have continuous [00:45:00] improvement. We need to keep moving towards this thing that's, probably unreachable, but we keep gunning for it, like we keep pursuing it.

the companies that have the best visions, everyone stays passionate about. Now you as the leader, have to keep adding coals to that fire because. In the busyness of the day, they keep forgetting it, right? So you have to keep bringing back to it. But in your own personal vision, it has to be a fire in the belly that keeps you going, getting you up each day and making you wanna be better tomorrow than you were today.

Jeffrey Feldberg: I absolutely value what you're saying is some great wisdom of every day. Just small, simple steps every single day. Add it up over time, make all the difference. And before we go into rapid mode, I know I said this was the last question, but one more follow up question to that. Low hanging fruit. So a listener in Deep Nation, they're listening to us talk this fireside chat before they go into their next activity, whatever that may be.

It could be a meeting, a call, who knows what it is. What would be one action, one leadership action today from your [00:46:00] arsenal of tools, Paul, what would be one low hanging fruit that they could do today that could really move the dial?

Paul Casey: If they're gonna go into a meeting, if you're giving me. That scenario, I'm gonna say your preparation is golden. Actually block out time to prepare for that interaction. That meeting could be a one-on-one. It could be with your whole team. It could be with a potential client and think through what are the outcomes that you want from each item on that agenda?

Is it just to discuss and brainstorm because that's gonna set the tone for the whole discussion, and then everyone will know that's what we're trying to do. Is it a decision that must be reached today? If I say that upfront on the agenda? Declare that out loud. We're gonna push for that decision to be made.

And then of course, that's the structure. Then we allow for a little bit of chaos and allow the discussion to unfold in front of us till we get to that best decision. So the low hanging free would be, I. Prepare better for meetings with your whole team, with [00:47:00] one-to-ones for your strategy sessions, and think about what outcome do you want on the front end.

It's the old Stephen Covey. Begin with the end in mind, and I bet you're gonna get there and you're not gonna wander or go on as many tangents. I.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Actually just saying that Paul is really full circle because when you're talking about preparation, it's one of the things that we started off this call with, and not to put words in your mouth, it was as though I was hearing Jeffrey, I really didn't do enough preparation. I. And as I unknowingly ended up working out for me, but unknowingly, I made this change, but I did it without the preparation, paid a price for it.

Took me some time to figure it out. Had I done that preparation, maybe I would've been in a different place. Maybe I wouldn't have done it at all, but the preparation was my one blind or inflection point, or a blind spot that I simply didn't recognize at the time. Thoughts about that.

Paul Casey: Yeah, nice call back, Jeffrey. 'cause I did start with counting the cost, right? And that is the preparation piece, right? It's thinking in advance of what do I want out of this? Engagement and didn't do that quite as well. [00:48:00] Could have done it better, lessons learned from it. But I would coach someone else to do that now based on my experience.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Yeah, some terrific insights there, and as you're talking about that, my goodness, Paul, and I've often joked on the podcast. Every mistake. If I had a dollar for every mistake that I made, I would not have needed my exit deal. I would've been able to retire well beyond my nine figure exit deal for every dollar for every mistake that I made.

So I hear you on that. I'm with you right there. And so that said, this is gonna be your second kick at the can, as you know here in the Depot podcast, it's our tradition where it's my privilege, it's my honor to ask. Every guest the same question, even repeat guests like yourself. It's a fun question.

Let me remind you of the question. When you think of the movie Back to the Future, you have that magical DeLorean car that will take you to any point in time. So Paul is tomorrow morning, you look outside your window, and this is the fun part. Not only is the DeLorean car curbside, the door is open, it's waiting for you to hop on in what you do, and you're now gonna go to any point in your life, Paul, as a young child, a [00:49:00] teenager, whatever point in time it would be.

What would you tell your younger self in terms of life lessons or life wisdom or, Hey Paul, do this, but don't do that. What would that sound like?

Paul Casey: I think I would've told myself to actually go for it. Don't settle for my conditioning. I became a, elementary school teacher right out of college, which is a very noble profession. Probably the most noble profession is to be a teacher, right? And I was like, I'm gonna ride that out the rest of my life.

Not thinking there were any other options. There was nothing bigger in store for me. And then I had a leader say, I think you should be a school principal. And I went well, if you think I could do it. And I, well, I was a vice principal first, and then I was asked to be a principal years later. Well, if you think I can do it, and I just gave myself the opportunity to do that.

But my thinking was so small at the beginning and I didn't even understand the concept of leadership. I. So I would've told myself like at that moment, study leadership at a very early age, stay [00:50:00] open to bigger options and then think about is this fulfilling? Because being an entrepreneur is so much fun.

I mean, it's got its headaches, but if I would've known that I would've become an entrepreneur way earlier in life and not gone with just my conditioning.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Wow, so many takeaways and lessons. Believe in yourself. Go for it. Don't settle for less. Have that. Big dream, that big vision, go for it and see where that takes you. There's a lot to be said for that. And Paul, for the listeners, they have some questions. They wanna have a conversation with you. They'd like to go through one of your programs, they'd like you to even coach them.

Where would be the best place online to reach you?

Paul Casey: Thank you for that opportunity. my website is growing forward services.net. On the Instagram and the Facebook and the LinkedIn growing forward services. Is there LinkedIn Probably if you wanna contact me personally, it's Paul D. Casey. The other Paul Casey is a professional golfer and I'm just a duffer, so don't go there.

But Paul D. Casey is my LinkedIn and that's [00:51:00] probably one of the best ways to get in contact with me. I would love to just be a growth catalyst in your life.

Jeffrey Feldberg: Wonderful and Pulp Nation. The great news is it doesn't get any easier. Go to the show notes. It's a point and click. It's. All there for you, including the quiz. All these other resources that Paul has done for us, it's ready to go and off you go with that. And so that said, Paul, congratulations, it's official.

As we love to say here at Deep Wealth, may you continue to thrive and prosper while you remain healthy and safe. Thank you so much.

Paul Casey: It's been a pleasure. 

Jeffrey Feldberg: So there you have it, Deep Wealth Nation. What did you think? 

So with all that said and as we wrap it up, I have another question for you.

Actually, it's more of a personal favor. 

Did you find this episode helpful? 

Have you found other episodes of the Deep Wealth Podcast empowering and a game changer for your journey? 

And if you said yes, and I really hope you did, I have a small but really meaningful way that you can actually help us out and keep these episodes coming to you.

Are you ready for it? 

The dramatic pause. I'll just wait a moment. Drumroll, please. Subscribe. [00:52:00] Please subscribe to the Deep Wealth podcast on your favorite podcast channel. When you subscribe to the Deep Wealth Podcast, you're saving yourself time. Every episode automatically comes to you, and I want you to know that we meticulously craft Every one of our episodes to have impactful strategies, stories, expert insights that are designed to help you grow your profits, increase the value of your business, and yes, even optimize your post exit life and your life right now, whatever you want that to look like.

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So all that said. Thank you so much for listening. And remember your wealth isn't just about the money in the bank. It's about the depth of your journey and the impact that you're creating. So let's continue this journey together. And from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much for listening to this episode.

And as we love to say here at Deep Wealth, may you continue to thrive and prosper while you remain healthy and safe. 

Thank you so much. 

God bless.